Student Notes

Default Synthesis Topic: What is your opinion, citing both Into Thin Air and Everest, about who should be allowed to climb the world's highest mountain?

Essay should be 500 - 750 words in MLA format. Do your own work and give others credit where needed to avoid plagiarism.

Default Synthesis Topic: What is your opinion, citing both Into Thin Air and Everest, about who should be allowed to climb the world's highest mountain?

Student Notes

Archived research Topics

Essay

Tuesday, September 21, 2004
11:55 AM

Movie Notes on IMAX film: EVEREST * Humans cannot survive on Everest, the body wasn't built that way and many have died upon Everest * In 1953 the first two climbers reached the top ( Hillary and Tenzing ) * Names of climbers in movie: Ed Viesturs (USA)- leader of group Araceli Segarra (Spain) Jamling Norgay Sherpa (India) * Climbers in this movie were helicoptered up to 5,000ft on Everest to give them a head start. * April 2 Base Camp was reached * In the high altitudes the number of red blood cells double to help oxygen flow to the brain. * There were 12 other groups on the mountain that day * Several times a day you could hear the roar of avalances falling. Avalances are 1/3 of the cause of death upon Everest * After getting to Middle Camp the climbers now must drink more water to help them survive * On May 8 a tragedy struck a group that was climbing for the top lead by Rob Hall (a friend of Ed Viesturs). A storm hit them that had Hurricane force winds. By 7 a.m the next morning 7 climbers from the group were still missing. Rob Hall was able to make radio contact with Base Camp and told them that he was unable to move. Rob didn't survive the night. They now went out on a search for Beck Weathers (a member of the lost group). Beck was found and survived but lost his hands due to the cold. * A total of 8 people from the group died on the mountain including Rob Hall. * The team from the film now decided to continue their climb for the top with Ed leading the way. It would be a 2 day climb on 4,000ft of ice. * The wind at High Camp finally settled down and the climb went on. * Ed didn't use supplementary oxygen and got to the top on the mountain first since he had previously climbed Everest 3 times prior. * Ed stumbled upon his dead friend Rob's body during his climb and sat down next to him and cried then continued for the top. * On Ed's decent he stoped and smiled at Araceli and Sumiyo and told them it wasn't much further. * Araceli and Jamling made it to the top. Araceli became the first Spanish woman to reach the top. * After 9 weeks they had finally finished their climb. They never thought that they would make it and would have never guessed they would have been a part of such a tragedy. Michelle Cooksey T/R 2:00 to 3:15 Humans

Tuesday, September 21, 2004
01:46 PM

Originally submitted by Urbonaite, Vitalija on Thu 9/2/2004 4:25 PM On Thursday 09-02-04 we arranged in our groups and had to put down 5 the most interesting facts about Mt. Everest.Then we read them loud to all the class and discuss. Here are some facts : 1. In 2001 the first legally blind person climbed Everest 2. "Viagra" helps in acclimating the higher altitudes by increasing circulation of blood:).Even the instructor found this new to him.:) 3. The youngest person attempted climbing was only 15 years old. 4. The largest number of adventurers per one day to reach the peak was of 40. 5.Chinese people gathered team of as big as 410 climbers. 6.It is estimated that average temparature on Mt. Everest is negative 100 F,while the hottest( if we could call that) is negative 15 F. 7. One of our unique names' group facted that the oldest person to climb everest was 68 years old, but at the next moment another group got more updated news with the oldest climber to be 70. 8. In 1975 the first man who didn't use supplement oxygen reached the top of the world that way. We heard more information about Mt. Everest but these were the most interesting. Our classes ended with reminder to read chapters 1-3 by next Tuesday.On next Thursday we will be watching Everest imax movie. I hope this helps whoever missed the class. Vitalija.

Thursday, September 23, 2004
05:21 PM

Chapter # 11. Octopus group Jon Krakauer writes that they finally left base camp on May 6th 4.30. Although, he breaks trek’s first destination to more reasonable Camp #2, he knows that this time they are going for the summit. Before their goal woul be reached climbers either got injured or experienced severely bad health problems, or changed their mind and returned back. For example, a solo climber from Sweden, Goran Kropp, afer his intended seven-month continued trip from sea level to the top of Everest, turned back. Being just 60 minutes away from the summit, Goran realized that he would lack strength to descend safely if climbed any higher. Robert Hall admired this incredible rational judgment of Goran’s own capability. In contrast, Doug, whose throat was bothering him and thus he became weaker, said that he put too much to give up everything he’d got. Taiwanese unexpected death after his fall in crevasse also terrified others. Krakauer often mentions that more and more tiresome was becoming their trek. Indeed, an intense relationship between Fisher and Boukreev built unnecessary worries. The conflict started because Boukreev didn’t obey Fisher’s commands and instead of climbing with the team he stayed 5 yours behind. He had strong opinion about pampered and climbers that require a lot of help shouldn’t be on the mountain at the beginning. Since Fisher paid him as much as 10.000 dollars more than usually salary, he expected Boukreev to do his job precisely. On May 8th Fisher’s and Hall’s teams departed Camp #2. They were about to climb Lhotse Face. Once climbing Andy Harris was harshly hit by sliding rock. Luckily he was clipped to the rope. When “Adventure Consultants Guided Expedition” reached Camp # 3 they started working right away. Only now they realized how appreciative they were for Sherpas. Snow melting and cooking 24,000 feet above are really strenuous tasks. Once again in chapter # 11 Krakauer contrasts Hall’s and Fisher’s guiding strategy. Leaving everybody from a team to climb independently was not the best idea of Fisher, as a guide. For that reason he had to make frequently ups and downs to check on the slower climbers. Couple more interesting facts we mentioned that in 1970’s Tyrolean alpinist Reinhold Messner was the first climber to climb Everest without bottled oxygen. Hence, later climbers challenged themselves and reach for the same goal. Krakauer with the rest of Hall’s team did not even take in consideration climbing without supplemented oxygen due to extreme vulnerability to HAPE, HACE, and seized thinking, breathing, and climbing. Vitalija- Miss Octopus:)

Tuesday, September 28, 2004
11:43 AM

For anyone who needs more imformation on the Everest Imax film. You can go to http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/everest/expeditions/96/week4/newsflash/news520.html hope this helps some of you. Donald Poling

Thursday, September 30, 2004
11:17 AM

Submitted by David Kirn of the 'We Hate Cats' group. Chapter 14 (Into Thin Air) Jon Krakauer realizes he is running out of oxygen. He decides to take a few pictures before heading down. In order to conserve air, he asks his friend Andy to shut off his tank. Instead, though, Andy cranks it all the way open. Within approximately ten minutes, Krakauer's oxygen tank empties. During this time, the other climbers reach the summit. Rob Hall shares his disappointment with Krakauer that five of his eight climbers quit, and that Scott Fischer's entire crew made it. This, of course, caused unwanted tension, since the two of then were competitors. In response to Krakauer's need for oxygen, Mike Groom came to the rescue. He gave Krakauer his air tank. Groom has climbed Everest before without oxygen bottles. Krakauer came across Beck Weathers on his way down the mountain. Weathers was wondering around in the snow. Evidently his vision was gone as a result of the low barometric pressure at Everest's high altitude. Weathers had undergone a corrective eye surgeory for myopia which results in this sensitivity. Beck Weathers wanted to wait, in his poor condition, for Mike Groom to return, thus rejecting Krakauer's offer to assist. Once again, Krakauer runs out of oxygen, but manages to find Andy at the final incline down to base camp. Andy slips, and safely falls to the base. Kraukauer throws his backpack down, then follows. Both make it back to camp okay.

Thursday, September 30, 2004
12:46 PM

Chapter 2 Summary: Humans- Michelle Cooksey Chapter two starts out in 1852 in India when the "highest mountain in the world" was discovered. Radhanath Sikhdar and surveyors first measured the angle of the mountains rise with a 24 inch theodolite. There was some speculation of wether it was in deed the tallest peak in the world. The mountain they call Everest was named in honor of Sir George Everest. Everest had other native names but Everest was the one that stuck. The chapter then goes into who was the first two men to climb Everest, Mallory and Irvine attempted the climb in 1924 but never returned. So the credit never went to them. In 1949 Nepal opened its borders and climbers focused their attention in their direction. 1953 was when a large British team went forth with another climbing attempt. In this group Hillary and Tensing became the first two men to stand on top of Mt. Everest. Chapter two then goes into Krakauers childhood. He lived in Oregon and in his teens climbed his first mountain, a 9,000 ft volcano. He has a secret dream of climbing Everest that no one knows about and by the time he was in his late twentys climbing was a very large portion of his life. Also, Chapter two talkes about the serious problems in terms of safty on the mountain. Fees jumped from $2,300 to $70,000 in trying to make people not climb Everest. At the end of the chapter Outside Magazine contacted Jon to take a trip to Everest and document the climb for a story. Jon told Outside Magazine that he would only take on the assignment if he was allowed to climb all the way to the top and that they would pay for it as well. Outside agreed and Jon was on his way.

Sunday, October 03, 2004
08:52 PM

October ,03 2004 8:11pm Chapter 5-Rob called Andy's radio at camp lobuje, tellinh him that it took 35 sherpas from different expeditions to take Tenzing down to the base camp. Strapping him to an aluminum ladder.He also told him that he and the resst of the team can leave lodge Lobuje in the morning and head back to base camp.On the 3rd night at Lobuje Andy had eaten something at dinner that did not sit well on his stomach and it made him feel sick.The next morning Andy was weak and dehydrated. He refused to stay at Lobuje another night when asked to , because of it being very filty. aT 9AM they all packed and headed on their way to base camp.Andy made lots of stops beefore getting to base camp.They stayed six weeks at Ad Hoc village. Day by day Lou, Stuart,John, Andy and the other team mates got sick, suffering from attacks of gastrointestinal distress that kept them racing to the latrines. Helen and Doug were plagued by severe headaches. There were many stories heard about how everest had been turned into a garbage dump by the ever increasing hordes, and commercial expeditions were reputed to be the primary culprits.In the 1970's base was indeed a dump.Rob and Gary made an effort and removed 5 tons of garbage from the camp, along with some of their fellow guides worked with the government ministries in Kathmandu to formulate a policy that will encourage the climbers to keep the mountainclean. In addition, each member of an expedition were charged 4,000 dollars fee that will be refunded only if a certain amount of trash were brought back to Namniche and Kathmandu. Hall's adventur consultants served as the seat of government also whenever there was any dispute they went to Hall's tent. Later in the years Fischer had become a new rival, competing against Hall for client.Scott was a kind of man that pushed beyond any physical limitations. Scott was unable to land a commercial sponsorship of the sort o enjoyed by some of his more famous peers. He felt as though some of the top climbers did not respect him.LEONIE KING, HUMANS

Sunday, October 03, 2004
09:50 PM

oCTOBER,03,2004 9:00 CHAPTER 18-At 4pm on May 10th, about the same time Doug Hansen who was supported by Rob Hall due to his hurting, three climbers from the nothern Indian province of Ladakhis radioed their their expedition leader sayin they were on top of everest. At the high camp at 27,230 ft, the Ladakhis party of six members left at 5:45am. By afternoon they were still more than a thousand vertical feet below the top, because of the same storm they encountered on the other side of the mountain. Three of the membes stopped and continued around 2pm, while the other thre Smanla,Paljor, and Monrup went onward despite the deterioting weather.By 4pm the three reached what was believed to be the summit of everest. By then the clouds made the visibility of everyting reduced no more than 100ft. The team left an offering of prayer flags,katas and climbing pitons on the highest point and descended into the fast rising blizzard.It appeared that the three members were only at 28,550 ft, when they turned around, 2 hours below the actual summit which was still about the highest clouds, whichis why they did not see Hansen nor Rob, or lopsang on top and vice versa. None of the three ladakhis had made it back to their tent that night.On may 10th, that morning Anatol Boukrev was frantically searching for Sany Pitman , Charlotte and Tim, two Japanese climbers, accompanied by three sherpas. Just beyond the top of the second step smanla and morup was appearently close to death. The japanese that passed them by did not stop to help them they figured they were going to slow them down. The third ladakhis was not found. On may 17th two ladakhis and three sherpas came upon the frozen bodies of thier teammates, one of the men in his death throes had torn offmost of his clothing.Smanla,morup and paljor were left on the mountain, where they had fallen. LEONIE KING, HUMANS.

Monday, October 04, 2004
04:55 PM

CHAPTER 4 Thomas f. Thornbein and his teammates went to everest from lukla, north through the crepuscular gorge of the Dudh Kosi, an icy boulder choked river that churned with glacial runoff.The night of their first trek, they stayed in the hamlet phakding, on a shelf of level ground above the river. The next morning they headed up the trail to continue their journey. Ttemperature through the depth of canyons began to soar as the sun rose high. As they climbed, they saw the landscape of the beautiful Budh Kosi.The land had been terraced and planted with barley, potatoes,bitter buckwheat, and strings of prayer flags were strung across the hillside and ancient Budhist religios monument "chorten". The team rested 10,300ft about sea level, at Khumbu lodge. While at khumbu lodge Hall introduced Thomas to Mike, the expedition's third guide. In 1987 Mike was forced to spend a night in the open while descending from the 28,169ft summit of kanchen junga. He froze his feet and had to have all his toes amputated. Later that night, the team sat at dinner and poked fun at each other. Some of the members felt a bit uncomfortable and got up and left the table. For better or worse, the economy and culture of the khumbu has become the increasingly and irrevocably tied to the seasonal influx of the trekkers and climbers, some 15,000 of whom visit the region annually. Ever since 1922, when seven sherpas were killed by an avalanche during the second british expedition, a dispropotionate number of sherpas have died on everest.The sherpas were accounted for more that a third of all everest fatalities. The next eight expeditions were forced to approach the mounain from the north through tibet and never passed anywhere near the khumbu. The first six days of the trek went bby in an ambrosial blur. Their own speed, pausing often for refreshment at trailside teahouses. Thomass, Doug and Andy were always travelling closer together. This was Andy first time to everest, but no stranger to the mountains. On april 4th and 5th the team stayed at pheriche. On the 7th they trek above pheriche and arrived at the lower and of the khumbu at 16.00ft now to the summit. The altitude began to change , and caused some of them to feel light headed.As they climbed higher there was no more green, only crest of glaciers and wind blown ice. Later in the day, they reached a village called Lobuje, crouded with other sherpas and climbers from different expeditions.The vilage was a very grim place. The lodge was filthy , toilets were overflowing with excrements. People had to evacuate their bowels outside on the open ground. The matress were filled with lice and fleas. LEONIE KING-HUMANS

Thursday, October 07, 2004
12:13 PM

Chapter 17 Notes: *Fischer and most of his group made it to the summit on May 10th * Hall is on the summit waiting on Hansen * Fischers sherpa that Fischer has become ill *4:00p.m. Hall saw Hansen and went to help him (Hansen dies and Hall is forced to leave him) *Hall radios to Base camp to inform them that Hansen was dead and that he was in trouble. *Info was given to Hall that the oxygen tanks were empty (Which was wrong info) *Fischer decided that he wanted to jump off the mountain and actually tried. His sherpa connected to him and helped him as much as he could *Fischers sherpa (Lopsing) gets lost in the storm after leaving Fischer for dead. Lopsing makes it to camp safely. *Halls only oxygen supply hose froze. Hall got connected to his wife thru radio and got to name his unborn child, and said goodbye. Hall dies shortly after. Chapter 19 Notes: *The rest of Halls team struggles to get down off the mountain. *Hansen and Harris are now for sure dead. *There is now no oxygen left *Yasuko and Weathers are thought to be dead. *A large chunk of ice fell from the Lhotse Face and hit a sherpa in the face, but he is ok. *The IMAX team begins to help with all the injured and the search for people. * Beck Weathers was found alive. They had to chip ice away from his face and he had very bad frostbite. Michelle Cooksey (HUMANS)

Thursday, October 07, 2004
12:36 PM

Chapter 20 Notes: *Krakauer and teammates are leaving the South Col. *The shrunken size of the group from 11 to 6 shook up some people. *Hutchison was in the back of the pack, Krakauer noticed that he was not wearing his goggles (without them he could go snow-blind very quickly) *Lopsang (Fischers Sherpa) caught up with the group and was overwhelmed with grief for Scott. Lopsang said and I quote "I am very bad luck ... It is my fault... I am very bad luck." *Makalu Gau was brought in to Camp two by 6 sherpas and was immediatly striped of clothes and an IV was givin. The docs thought that he had the worse case of frostbite they had ever seen. *Shortly after that Breashear came on the radio and announced that he was on his way down with Beck. *Beck was treated the same as all the rest but to everyones amazement Beck was able to stand up on his own. *8 healthy climbers had to help Beck down steep parts of the mountain. *Krakauer got out of his tent and went to help get Beck down. *May 13th Krakauer scouted out a somewhat level place to land an helicopter. He used Kool-aid to mark the landing area. *The helicopter pilot said that he could only take one peron abord for fear of not getting off without crashing. * Makalu Gau was chosen to go because his feet had already been defrosted. *Thinking that Beck was going to have to make the trip down the helicopter left and then actually came back for Beck. * Michelle Cooksey (HUMANS)

Saturday, October 09, 2004
09:32 PM

Amy Carroll – We Hate Cats Group – Chapter 3 John Krakauer has been on Thai flight 311 from Bangkok to Kathmandu for two hours. Krakauer leaves his seat and goes to the back and crouches by some waist level windows hoping to get a glimpse of some mountains, he was not disappointed. The himalaya was jagged against the horizon. Krakauer stayed at the windows for the rest of the flight. He saw 3 more mountains while he stood there. One was the Fanchenjunga which is which is 28,169 feet above sea level and is the third highest mountain on earth. Next he saw Makalu, which is the fifth highest peak in the world. And the last he saw was Everest. Forty minutes later Krakauer was off the plane and in Kathmandu. As he walked into the airport lobby a man noticed his two huge duffel bags and approached him. He consulted a photocopied sheet containing passport photos of Rob Halls clients, and inquired if he was Jon. He shook Krakauers hand and introduced himself as Andy Harris. Andy was one of Rob Hall's guides, and had come to take him to the hotel. There was one more client arriving from the same flight a 53 year old attorney named Lou Kasischke from Bloomfield Hills, Michigan. Krakauer and Harris talked about hard climbs and the merits of skiing vs. snowboarding while waiting for Kasischke. Before Lou emerged Jon asked Andy how many times had he been on Everest, and he responded that this would be his first time. Jon and Lou had b been booked at the Garuda Hotel which was located in the heart of Thamel. The Garuda is a popular spot for expeditions going to the Himalayas. Its walls are covered with signed photographs of famous alpinists who had slept there over the years. As Jon went to his room he passed a picture of Rob Hall. An hour later Jon met Rob. The book continues to describe Rob. Rob was born in Christchurch, New Zealand into a working class catholic family. He is the youngest of 9 children. Rob dropped out of school at the age of 15 and went tot work for Alp Sports. At the age of 16 and 17 he was running their entire production side. When Rob was 19 in 1980 he climbed the north ridge of Ama Dablam a 22,294 foot peak. This was Robs first trip to the himalaya and while he was there he made a side excursion to Everest base camp. He decided that day that one day he would climb Everest. It took 10 years and 3 attempts, and then in May of 1990 he finally reached the summit of Everest as the leader of an expedition. This expedition included Peter Hillary the son of Sir Edmund Hillary. When they summited they made a radio transmission that was broadcast live throughout New Zealand, and they received congratulations from Prime Minister Geoffrey Palmer. In 1990 Rob Hall and Gary Ball decided that they would climb the highest summits on each of the seven continents within seven months. A couple of hours away from their 7 month deadline on December 12, 1990 they reached the crest of the 7th summit; the Vinson Massif at 16, 067 feet the highest point in Antarctica,After the seven summits in 7 months Hall and Ball decided to become partners in high altitude guiding. They called the enterprise Adventure consultants. They racked up an impressive record. Hall and Ball led 6 clients to the summit of Everest in May of 1992. Another group of 7 made it to the summit a year later that was guided by Hall and Ball. That afternoon 40 people has reached the summit in single day. After they arrived home from that expedition Sir Edmund Hillary criticized Hall's role in the growing commercialization of Everest. Sir Edmund stated that they “were engendering disrespect for the mountain”. In October of 1993 Gary Ball died of cerebal edema which is swelling of the brain brought on by high altitude. This happened during an attempt on the 26,795 foot Dhaulagiri, the worlds 6th tallest mountain. Gary Ball died in Rob Hall's arms. After Gary's death, Hall decided to carry on with Adventure Consultants alone. Hall put 39 climbers on the summit of Everest between 1990 and 1995. Rob was charging $65,000.00 a head to guide clients on Everest by 1996. This quote did not include airfare and personal equipment. On March 31, 1996 2 days after arriving in Kathmandu the members of Adventure Consultants Everest Expedition climbed aboard a Russian built Mi-17 helicopter operated by Asian airlines. The chopper was to set them in the village of Lukla, 9,200 feet up in the himalaya. During the helicopter ride Krakauer tried to memorize his teammates names. These included the guides Rob Hall and Andy Harris, Helen Wilton the base camp manager, Caroline Mackenzie a physician, and the clients Lou Kasischke a lawyer, Yasuko Namba a taciturn personnel director, Beck Weathers a pathologist, Stuart Hutchison cardiologist, John Taske an anesthesiologist, Frank Fischbeck a publisher from Hong Kong, and Doug Hanson a postal worker. Krakauer wasn't sure what to make of his fellow teammates. Jon thought they seemed like nice people, but that it was still too soon for their true colors to show. Jon was feeling uneasy because he had never climbed with such a large group before.

Sunday, October 10, 2004
02:37 PM

Krakauer-Chapter 17--David Kirn of 'We Hate Cats.'--Scott Fischer and his group made the summit on May 10, 1996. **Rob Hall was there waiting on Hansen. What is unuaual about this is the time is 3:40pm. This is almost 2 hours past Hall's madatory 2:00pm turn aroun time. **Fischer's sherpa Lopsang said Fischer was complaining about feeling ill. **Fischer and his group left Hall alone on the summit. **Hall waited for Hansen, it is believed, out of guilt for convencing Hansen to climb Everst again in the first place. **Finally, at 4:00pm, Hall saw Hansen having difficulty reaching the summit. Hall helped Hansen the final 40 feet. **Hansen was out of oxygen, and had used up all of his strength on the climb up. **Hall contacted camp, via radio, to inform the others that he and Hansen were in trouble. They needed oxygen. **Because Andy Harris was suffering from hypoxic dementia, Hall was given the wrong information about the oxygen tanks at the South Summit. **Also, faulty radio equipment prevented Mike Groom from contacting Hall with the correct information. There really was some good tanks at South Summit. **Lopsang intercepts Fischer on the way down, and prevents him from jumping. Fischer was delusional from exhaustion. Lopsang ties a securing rope around Fischer, using himself as the anchor. **Around 6:00pm a very bad strom begins to brew. **Fischer can no longer walk, and Lopsang attemps to carry him. This fails because he is exhausted. While resting, another group appears led by Makalu Gau. They leave a Taiwanese climber with Fischer and Lopsang. **Lopsang leaves them to go get help, but gets lost. He takes 4 hours to descend. **Hall never got the help he needed. **Hansen and Harris die. **Hall eventually reached the South Summit on his own, and, at 4:43am, found two oxygen canisters. He contacts base at to inform them that he found air, but his hoses were frozen. **At 9:00am, Hall got his hoses thawed and oxygen flowing. **The camp contacted Hall's wife. They tried to use her to give Hall strength. They talked about their soon to be born child and their love for each other. **Hall died.

Sunday, October 10, 2004
02:45 PM

Krakauer-Chapter 19-David Kirn of the 'We Hate Cats.'--**Jon Krakauer and his group are descending to base camp. **They find out for sure about the death of Hansen and Harris. **There is a lot of arguing during the descent, and they have no oxygen. **Multiple healthe issues arrise from the high altitude and oxygen deprivation. **Hall's group loses there sherpas from an accident. **The Imax team comes to the rescue. **Finally, Beck Weathers is found wondering around near base camp. He is suffering from severe frost bite.

Monday, October 11, 2004
12:52 PM

Possible topics for the in-class essay: 1.Is the dream worth suffering? 2.Do Everest Gods protect only sherpas? 3.Half way to success. 4.Into the death zone. Vitalija-Octopus group

Monday, October 11, 2004
07:12 PM

I would like to do my research topic on wether or not it would be worth it for you to climb Mt. Everest. Assuming that you were an experienced climber and had the money to do so. Use pros @ cons, examples from the book, and other details.

Monday, October 11, 2004
10:12 PM

Mitchell Clary- TOPICS FOR IN CLASS ESSAY I think that a good topic for the essay would be a comparison of the two different teams of Rob Hall's expedition and Scott Fischer's expedition and which one would choose to climb with if they were still alive and why using details from the book supportiing your decision.

Tuesday, October 12, 2004
12:21 AM

Jon Krakauer: The main character Anatoli Boukreev: The Russian climbing guide working for the American Expedition Andy Harris: Guide from New Zealand Rob Hall: New Zealand Guide Leader Scott Fischer: American Guide Leader Yasuko Namba: 47 year old Japanese woman Doug Hansen: The postal worker from Seattle(closest friend to Krakaur) Lou Kasischke: 53 year old attorney from Bloomfield Hills,Michigan Erol Atkins(human)

Tuesday, October 12, 2004
01:17 AM

James Pietrick we hate cats group chp 16 Jon Krakauer is awakend in his tent by Stuart Hutchison to tell him Andy Harris is not in any of the tents. But Krakauer had seen Andy come into the edge of camp with his own eyes. Krakauer went to were andy had first sled down the ice just before the Col and followed the route Andy had taken back to camp, he realized that Andy had not turned left but instead continued straight down the gully. Which would be easy to do so even if one did not have altitude sickness which would lead him to the western most edge of the Col. Below that was steep ice of th Lhotse Face which was 4,000 foot drop into a dark abyss.Krakauer thought this because he saw a faint crampon tracks leading past him into the dark. They then had to send word back to his girlfriend Fiona McPherson that he was missing and presumed dead after they had already told her he had made it back to camp safley.shortly after Andy turned up missing they learned that Beck and Yasuko were dead and Scott Fischer was missing. Then the batteries for their radio went dead and they then tryed to use the radio of the South Afericans team because they had a strong radio but Woodall said no. After the expedition he interviewed as much people in Halls and Fischers team as possible and learned that when he interviewed Martin Adams he told him how he got down and had run into an anonymous climber was really Krakauer and who krakaure thought was Andy Harris was really Martin Adams so he hadnt seen Andy Make it to camp he wonder what really happened to him and how he could mistake someone he had spent six weeks with someone else.

Tuesday, October 12, 2004
10:26 AM

CHAPTER 9 - Camp 2; April 28, 1996; 21,300 feet - Melissa Knapp - We Hate Cats *April 26, 1996 they went from Base Camp to Camp 2 in one day for final acclimatization for summit push, leaving at 4:45am *windchill about 40 degrees below zero and they were forced to go back due to health problems forming; they arrived back at Camp 2 at noon and found that the Australian doctor, John Taske had minor frostnip on the tips of his fingers; Doug had more serious problems - they found frostbite forming on several toes (climbing Everest in 1995 he had lost tissue from a big toe due to frostbite, which permanently impaired his circulation, making him more susceptible to the cold; Doug also had minor throat surgery less then two week before leaving for Nepal; his trachea was very sensitive and he had frozen his larynx; Hall encouraged him that he was very tough and he still had a shot at the top after he recovered; Hall and leaders of taiwanese and South African teams began arguing over sharing responsibility for stringing more than a mile of rope needed for the route up the Lhotse Face; April 26, two sherpas from Taiwanese team and Sourth African team stayed in their sleeping bags and refused to cooperate; Woodall - South African leader - said that nobody ever came to wake the sherpas and tell them they were needed; Hall argues that Ang Dorje tried repeatedly but the sherpas ignored them; Woodall at this point threated to send his sherpas over to beat up Ang Dorje; meanwhile, Ngawang Topche condition worsened; the doctors believed HAPE was also accompanied by tuberculosis or other pre-existing pulmonary condition; the sherpas believed it was caused by a climber on Fischer's team was sleeping with a a member of another expedition; they believed that sex outside marriage angered the goddess of the sky - Sagarmatha; as journaled by Sandy Pittman on April 29, 1994 a girlie magazine had been sent by a fellow climber from back home as a joke, half the Sherpa took it to a test for a closer look, while the other half worried that it would cause a disaster; they said the goddess Chomolungma did not tolerate anything unclean on her sacred mountain; Lopsang was sherpa on Fischers team; he first made summit without supplemental oxygen on may 16, 1993; he continued to summit without oxygen and became very close with Fischer, staying under his employment even though he was not paid as much as he would have been by another leader

Tuesday, October 12, 2004
11:37 AM

Melissa Knapp - We Hate Cats group ROB HALL - aged 35, from New Zealand, leader of Adventure Consultants expedition SCOTT FISCHER - aged 40, American, leader of the Mountain Madness expedition - hist body was found at South Summit YASUKO NAMBA - Japanese, member of Hall's team; aged 47 - the oldest woman to reach the sumit of Everest ANDY HARRIS - aged 31, from New Zealand, guide on Hall's team - last seen at the South Summit DOUG HANSEN - aged 46, American, member of Hall's team, a postal worker who held down two jobs to pay for his dream to climb Everest - last seen on the knife-edge ridge between the Hillary Step and the South Summit WOODALL - South African-expedition leader MIKE GROOM - Australian guide ANATOLI BOUKREEV - Russian guide, one of Fischer's guides DAVID BREASHEARS - USA, leader anf film director for IMAX, his team also included others such as: Jamling Norgay Sherpa, Ed Viesturs, Araceli Segarra (Sprain, climber and film talent)Paula Viesturs (USA, Base Camp manger), Jamling Norgay (son of Tenzing Norgay) NEAL BEIDLEMAN - climber from Colorado, one of Fischer's guides SANDY PITTMAN - USA, client on Fischer's team, journalist DR. SEABORN BECK WEATHERS - USA, client HAPE - High Altitude Pulmonary Edema - results from fluid build-up in the lungs; as the condition becomes worse, the level of oxygen in the bloodsteam decreases and this can lead to impaired cerbral function and even death Phakding - 9,186 feet - March 31, 1996 Lobuje - 16,200 feet Base Camp - 17,600 feet Camp One - 19,500 feet Camp Two - 21,300 feet Camp Three - 24,000 feet Camp Four - 26,000 feet Summit - 29,028 feet

Thursday, October 21, 2004
03:46 PM

CHAPTER 6-Doing the details Boukreev and the sherpas got the base camp ready, while Gammelgaard, Fischer, and his publicity agent, also his friend "Jane Bromet" waited for the rest of the team at Kathmandu. Jane was eager to establish herself in the adventure industry. Her successful negotiation of the outside online arrangement provided both oppertunity and insurance. After leaving Seattle, Jane struck a deal with Pittman which allowed her use his sat. phones. Her first interview was with Fischer describing his clients and climbing guides Beidleman and Boukreev. As they prepared to climb everest, they learned that yaks were not able to get to everest base camp.Because of this the porters had to work much harder which caused them to double charges from 150 rupees to 300 rupees for the trip. The mountain Madness had an itenirary prepared to help clients avoid acute mountain sickness[AMS]. just before the expedition began , Fischer announced that insteadof helicoptering the clients to lukla, he was going to fly them with the expedition gear that had not been carried with boukreev and Ngima sherpa to Syaboche on march 29,where they reached four days ago. They did not get effects of the increased altitude from Kathmandu, but the clients did almost immediately. Jane reported 2 people were in bed with upset stomachs, that possibly caused from the the Kathmandu's casualties.Many of the team members took Diomox to help them more metabolize more oxygen. the climbers were kept informed about the progress being made because of Pittman's outside online site. Anatloi was a bit worried about the clients who no experience of high altitude assault, Tim , Shoening, GammelGaard and Dale. He could only count on the professional flair of Scott Fischer. HUMANS- LEONIE KING

Tuesday, October 26, 2004
04:05 PM

Vitalija-Octopus group. Chapter #20. At this point -May 11- Boukreev knew that lack of O2 is a serious problem. Especially, for the people who were still high on the mountain. Boukreev was worried that Andy Harris, Makalu Gau, Scott Fisher, Rob Hall were still missing at camp 4. The ones that made to camp 4 decided that everybody else up the mountain is dead. However, Boukreev didn't lose his hope to rescue Scott Ficher and others. Finally, after long search for help, two sherpas took supplemental O2 along with hot tea and left camp 4 in order to rescue climbers. They got Makalu Gau down and made it to Scott Fisher but left him there since no signs of life. Then Scott Fisher couldn't believe and trust what sherpas were saying. He went to rescue his most admirable friend (Scott Fisher).On his way up he encountered Beck Weathers going towards camp who look like "back from mortals" but still had energy to warn Anatoli not to go further. Nevertheless, seeing Beck alive Anatoli's hope to see Scott at least breathing increased. So he searched for him but found him dead. Unfortunately, the supplemental O2 didn't help him since the mask and the rest of his body was frozen. On his way down Anatoli run into strong wind, snow, and low visibility area. Luckily, noise coming from camp 4 guided his safe return.

Wednesday, October 27, 2004
12:32 PM

CHAPTER 7 Mountain madness remained at Gorak Shep, as they waited for the expedition yaks caravan to complete its supply runs.To kill time The team took a trip and summitted Kala Pattar 5554m from which the climbers had an unobstructed and dramatic view of the Khumbu icefall. The first serious obstacle they would encounter in their effort to summit everest.On Monday, April 8th, Fischer's team made their push down a trail onto Khumbu glacier. In about three hours the team reached everest base camp. They stayed in a tent that was going to be their home for next six weeks. In the mornings, the sherpas wake the team up and serve them coffee, and tea.They showers and mail service. Several of the climbers were struggling to adjust to the altitudes. Many of the first time climbers began to obsess with the bodily functions being self absrbed, worring about what their pee looked like, whether they ae having a bowel movement, or having a headache or not. Neal Biedleman one of Fischer's guides developed a khumbu's cough, which was severe. Dr Hunt was unable to help him. If he did not recover, Fischer, boukreev and the sherpas would have to carry the team themselves. Scott and Anatoli formulated a plan of four acclimatization excursion. Boukreev shared his thoughts about the expedions potential for success with Fischer. Boukreev on the otherhand was not receptive to Boukreev's decision for deep descend and rest before the summit.HUMANS-LEONIE KING

Wednesday, October 27, 2004
12:58 PM

chapter 17 Fischer an some of his other clients were on top of the summit around 3.45pm and it was beginning to get late. Around 4.30pm the people from Rob Hall's team came down to mountain madness camp and said that one of the members of Fischer was hurt at the hillary step and they needed oxygen to take back to them. Pemba was sked to take the oxygen, since they could not get in contact with Lopsang or anyone else, but he refused, and said that the weather is was too bad. Biedleman who could have responded to the radio call and reported emergency above him continued his descent. Just over the south summit Charlotte had given Sandy a dexamethasone shot because she was out of it.Six hundred vertical meters above camp iv, Boukreev was ruuning out of oxygen, and was feeling a bit disoriented. He did not know where to go, after a while Adam and some of Robs clients were approaching him below the balcony.At base camp DR. Hunt was having a problem getting jold of Fischer and Lopsang. At 5.45pm she learned that Fischer and Lopsang were just getting below the summit and they were out of oxygen and Fischer was very weak. Boukreev decided to back up the mountain taking 3 oxygen canisters with him and locating the ropes that might him to Fischer and Lopsang. Boukreev glacier glasses began to fog and he was beginning to lose his vision.He went back to the camp and into his tent and rested, when he awoke he did not have the strength to search for his teammates.HUMANS-LEONIE KING

Tuesday, October 05, 2004
03:14 PM

Mike Martin Humans Group For my research paper, I want to research Kurt Cobains death.

Thursday, October 07, 2004
10:35 AM

Sara Zelonka Research Topic: The CIA's Involvment in Bob Marley's Death

Thursday, October 07, 2004
12:18 PM

Michelle Cooksey (HUMANS)- I would like to do my research paper on the mysterious death of Jon Benet Ramsey.

Tuesday, October 12, 2004
01:19 AM

James Pietrick we hate cats group my research topic i would like to do it on John F. Kenndys assination

Thursday, October 14, 2004
10:03 PM

Amy Carroll - We Hate Cats Group: I would like to do my research topic on credit cards, the pro's and cons of them.

Saturday, October 23, 2004
11:56 PM

Daniel Powell-Sushi lover---- I would like to do my research paper on Paul Hamm the gymnist in the 2004 olympics weather he should give up his medal or keep it

Thursday, October 28, 2004
01:06 PM

Mr. Twiggs I would like to change my research topic to Genetically modified foods. Feeding the masses or killling us slowly? I have recently become very interested in this heated debate and would like the chance to look at it more in depth and use it as my research topic. Thank you! Sara Zelonka-Octopus

Monday, November 01, 2004
03:26 PM

Travis D- Octopus, I want to have Outsourcing : Good or Bad? for my research topic.

Tuesday, November 02, 2004
03:14 PM

David Kirn of the 'We Hate Cats' group -- As per our class discussion, my research paper will be on Roswell.

Wednesday, November 03, 2004
03:44 PM

Donald Poling- We hate cats. I think that every climber was responsable for their self, because once you are on Mt. Everest it is every man/women for their self. The guid and sherpas are there, but there is only so much they can do. On Everest everyone is responsible for their own life and no one else. Their were to many in experienced climbers and not enough time. I do not believe that Boukeev is responsible for any of the climbers while they are on the mountain, but only when they are off. Boukeev is lucky to be alive himself and should be greatful that everyone in his team did not die. All the climbers knew the risk that they were taking and the responsibility.

Wednesday, November 03, 2004
05:33 PM

Mitchell Clary, Sushi Lovers- I would like to do my research paper on the death of Darrell Russell, a NHRA Top Fuel Dragster Driver who was killed and find out if NHRA is responsible for his death.

Thursday, November 04, 2004
10:08 AM

Nick Rosa- Humans- The postscript basically talks about what Boukreev was up to a year later. Anatoli was still climbing and he met Yasuko Namba husband and with his friend translating had a conversasion about what had happened a year ago on Mount Everest. Emotions flared and Boukreev explained how he felt responsible for Yasuko's death. Yasuko's husband, Kenichi Namba told Anatoli that he blamed no one and that Yasuko Namba was a mountaineer.

Tuesday, November 09, 2004
12:04 PM

Vitalija-Octopus group. I would suggest topic for this in-class essay would be : What were the reasons that led to the 1996 tragedy? We have to look deeper into planning of the expedition, the amount of customers' high altitude experience, relationships among mountaineers,allowed authority for the guides to make decisions ,and high or low super-ego when it comes to choose to summit or descend.

Tuesday, November 09, 2004
10:37 PM

Amy Carroll-We Hate Cats Group- I would like to do my research project on the Bermuda Triangle.

Wednesday, December 01, 2004
04:15 PM

Donald Poling-We Hate Cats Professor Twiggs I am writting in regards to the research paper. I have been very sick for the past two weeks and never submitted my research topic to you. I wanted to know if it would be all right if I do my topic on the Zodiac Killer. Please E-mail me at Babyfaceduce@aol.com. I have two doctors notes for you. Thankyou very much

Wednesday, December 01, 2004
08:24 PM

Vitalija Urbonaite-Octopus group. Is anybody coming for peer review tomorrow Thursday December the 2nd?Let's meet in our class.

Arguments 20051:

Monday, October 18, 2004
12:08 PM

Vitalija Urbonaite- Octopus group In my opinion each of any team climbers should be checked for a high altitude experience. Also, mountaineers must be in a good health. Reading Jon Krakauer's book I didn't notice that any of criteria mattered in the expedition of 1996. The wisdom comes after the fact.Right?

Thursday, October 21, 2004
01:49 PM

Vitalija -Octopus group What I read so far in Boukreev's book Scott appears be a bigger problem on the mountain than any others. Scott failed to arrange radio distribution among guides; he rejected Boukreev’s idea to descend to the forest zone for better rest in thick air. He also regardless his impaired health made unnecessary ups and downs between camps. In addition it was very unprofessional to take antibiotics which are critical in high altitudes. I still don’t understand why the instructor questioned our opinion whether Boukreev is responsible for the deaths on Everest in 1996.

Thursday, October 21, 2004
03:34 PM

Russ lousignont/humans. So far I think that Scotts team was over all unprepared and Scott was looking to much into his own interest( popularity ) and avoiding conflict by telling anyone that they could come along for the climb. Even though his team was younger and stronger than Rob Hall's team, I don't like Scotts leadership style. The combo of Scott and Antoli, both being sort of independant left the Clients alone way to much. I feel that Rob did a better job of keeping his team on the same page. They all should have been aclimatized about the same because they were together more. Scott's team was all over the place. Some may have been ready for the summit and some not. But you would never know since the clients went up and down at their liesure, not sticking to Antoli's plan

Saturday, October 23, 2004
02:02 PM

Saturday, October 23 1:55pm Dolly Cooper-Sushi Lovers. I believe that Scott was being completely unprofessional in climbing while he was impaired and that he should have postponed untill he recovered from whatever ailment that he was suffering from. Also, I think that Boukreev is placing too much emphasis on wanting to climb the mountain for himself. He was hired to be a babysitter to the clients and his job was to catch stragglers and help push them up the mountain. I can understand that he is angry about this and even emphathise with him in his frustration at the fact that these novices with minimal training and who are not prepared at all are attempting to climb the largest mountain in the world. However, he was informed of this and took on the job knowing that his role would be to give aid and guidance to these clients, he accepted this and that is why he is on that mountain, to serve as a babysitter and to push them along, not to summit Everest on his own, or at his own pace.

Sunday, October 24, 2004
11:41 PM

James Pietrick-we hate cats group I believe that Boukreev should have mad more of an effort to help the climbers, then to just think of himself as a babysitter and since he was paid all of that money to help the climbers. Knowing that there were inexperienced climbers in his group. Even though there was a language barrier he could of made more of an effort because im sure body language or simple motions could of helped many of the climbers including Scott Fischer because Boukreev would of helped the climbers toward the back which would helped Fischer conserve more of his evergy.

Monday, October 25, 2004
03:23 PM

D.J. West Octopus Every body seems to be blaming Anatoli and Scott. I agree that they should have been more atentive to the clients. But in the end the individual climber is responsible for their own safety. They hired guides, not babysitters.

Monday, October 25, 2004
07:02 PM

David Kirn of the ‘We hate cats’ group—It appears to me that Boukreev was stuck in a rut. He chose to ignore the clients he was hired to look after, instead of adjusting to the needs of the group. I understand that people need to be responsible for their own lives on Mount Everest, but I also believe that Boukreev could have done more to prepare the clients under his responsibility. He should have stepped out of his comfort zone. If he had gotten over his single-mindedness and stubbornness, some of the lives may have been saved.

Monday, October 25, 2004
08:31 PM

Nick Rosa/ Humans I want to say that I think that Boukreev is a very experienced climber, but I don't think I would want him to be on my team just because he climbs at a fast pace leaving people behind.

Tuesday, October 26, 2004
01:01 AM

Daniel Powell--Sushi Lover-----I think Boukreev in the final chapters proved his self worthy on the mountain. He seemed to be the only climber who had enough energy to try to save others who were traped on the mountain during the storm. He new he had to get climber down, he didn't pass out from exhaustion like some other climbers.

Tuesday, October 26, 2004
11:26 AM

Summer Barker- "We Hate Cats"- I feel that Scott is very unprofessional. He is unprepared, and makes bad judgment by allowing unskilled and inexperienced climbers to join his group, risking the lives of everyone involved. Also, Scott should have waited until he felt better to continue climbing. On the other hand, I do feel that Anatoli is a good climber, but he is not doing his job. He was specifically hired to watch out for those in need and help others up the mountain. Perhaps, if he set aside his selfishness more lives could have been saved.

Tuesday, October 26, 2004
11:28 AM

robby word. octupus group. I don't believe Anatoli Boukareev was responsible for the deaths of many climbers on the slopes that fateful day. Even though i may disagree with a few of his actions (climbing ahead, not paying so much attention to clients,etc.) i believe the deaths happenend for a reason much greater. to keep people off the mountain. i also think it's weird how krakauer acted like he knew so much about anatoli's actions when the two groups, halls and fischers didn't even meet until late in the summit attempt. i think krakauer is sort of cocky and even he needed help on the mountain and made false observations while on the way back down from the summit. anatoli actually saved lives while krakauer was chillin in his tent. but overall i don't think anyone is to blame. even many experienced climbers died that day which tells me many things went wrong. i don't think people should be climbing everest at all. god works in mysterious ways.

Tuesday, October 26, 2004
12:59 PM

Travis D-Octopus.. Anatoli is an experianced climber. No disputing that. But for the reason he was hired and his personality combined closely resemble an Unatentive Sheep Herder. He may move about his sheep at will, keeping a lose eye on them. If one wanders away it's a loss that couldn't be avoided because that particular sheep was not as smart as the rest... But when the whole herd of sheep are endangered, he jumps into a more protective and more "savior" like stance. I believe this is only to save face and not look like a jack ass. Anatoli's personality is of a soloist. The differences between the books? Krakauer made himself look good from start to finish and made me <a reader who has never climed has these people have> feel like he was somewhat of a hero and made anatoli look like a Fool. Anatoli's book started off from chapter 1 to about 15, making him look like a greedy, antisocialist bent on handling things his own way. Chapter 19 <Q/A> chapter somewhat helps his character once he explains his side. As the book continues, we learn he is more willing to help as people start to die right and left.. also when Scott is in trouble. In my option, Krakauer's book was superior.

Tuesday, October 26, 2004
01:54 PM

Mike Martin-Humans-I think that everybody needs to take more credit for themselves. Yes they hired guides, but if they were not up to par physically, they should not have been attempting to climb the mountain. Like someone else said, they hired mountain guides, not babysitters.

Tuesday, October 26, 2004
03:43 PM

Vitalija-octopus group I am very proud of Boukreev because he was the only brave rescue after a long climbing to the top. Although, two sherpas (after convincing them to help the trapped climbers) finally agreed to help Boukreev and got Makalu down, their refuse to assist Boukreev in further rescue of Scott Fisher. Boukreev didn’t lose his hope that there might be some lives up the mountain like everybody else. However, reading “Into thin air” book we saw that Jon Krakauer at least was trying to gather rescue team but he was physically unable to make a rescue by himself. I agree that maybe Boukreev should facilitate other team members’ climbing. On another hand, being professional climber he didn’t think that people who are unable to experience Everest climbing would be on this mountain in the first place. Another thing is that, Scott Fisher didn’t provide Boukreev with authoritative power to take over the control of climbing. He only needed him in emergency situations for rescuing.

Wednesday, October 27, 2004
01:12 PM

So far after reading The climb, I do not believe Fischer and his team was well prepared to summit everest. Mountain Madness team were not working together as a team, Fischer was climbing at his own pace and had no knowledge of where the rest of the team members were or how they were doing. Boukreev on the other hand is way ahead of the rest of the team, he is worried about his team members but didn't have the courage to give his opinion on what to do, whether they should turn around and get back to the camp because it was getting too late and because they might run out of oxygen. Boukreev believed he did not have they authority to tell the members what to do because he was hired to help prepare the camp and the ropes.

Wednesday, October 27, 2004
07:02 PM

Mitchell Clary- Sushi Lovers. I believe that everyone wants to point fingers at everyone else on this climb blaming anyone that they can so they do not have to take the blame themselves. No matter who is to blame or who you want to blame, the end result is you were willing to take the risk and consequences while attempting to climb Everest so the only one that everyone should be looking at to blame is themselves no matter if you 50 years of climbing or if you have enough money to climb Everest 100 times.

Wednesday, October 27, 2004
07:07 PM

Mitchell Clary-Sushi Lovers. Another thing that I would like to add is that Fischer and Boukreev are two different types of climbers and I believe that each one could lead an expedition up to the Summit. Now, that does not mean I would climb with them but in my opinion, I think that they were both prepared enough for the climb and also having their team prepared. But on the other hand, I would also like to say that Fischer should have waited until he was well and recovered but the man was too hard-headed and too tough to listen or sit around and let everyone else try to led their team to the top.

Thursday, October 28, 2004
11:57 AM

robby word octupus- i think that anybody willing to try to climb everest knows the danger they are putting themselves in so it's nobody's fault. scott even said that boukareev would be a good guy to have on the team because if it hit the fan anatoli would be there to "get people off the mountain". and its amazing how many he did by himself. even though i understand why they didn't (fear), i don't understand how none of the sherpas could have lent a hand to anatoli when they have so much more altitude experience than even him. not that i would have tried it for 2000 dollars or whatever ridiculous amount they made for the trip but it seemed like they didn't want to help because there were not sherpas stranded or willing to help along side him.

Thursday, October 28, 2004
01:12 PM

Sara Zelonka-Octopus: I liked Boukreev's book better. It actually included the memories of other people involved. Krakuer seems like a pompous ass, and his speculation of what was going in Fischer's group seems unfounded now considering no one in Fischer's group interacted with him until the tragedy. So where does he get his information? I think the desire to be the best and to secure business in future years on both Hall's and Fischer's parts is the real cause. They both made choices they knew were unsafe but out of selfish desires made them anyway and many people suffered for them.

Thursday, October 28, 2004
01:21 PM

Sara Zelonka-Octopus: after reading the other arguments I still think that scott and rob hall both made bad decisions in order to further their careers, but really isn't it really the weather's fault? They should have turned back, saved their oxygen, started back down earlier, but I have also learned that hindsight is always 20/20. After reading Anatoli's book I think every person on the mountain that day contributed to the disaster, it was just a compounding of mistakes but I really don't like Krakuer's seemingly unfounded accusations. None of us can even imagine what it is like to be at altitude, our brains severly deprived of oxygen, so it is hard for an outsider to understand people's choices, so who is Krakuer to judge?

Friday, October 29, 2004
02:06 PM

Dolly Cooper-Sushi Lovers. There is no doubt in my mind that the events that day were caused by not only mother nature, but by everyone in the climbing groups. All of the climbers were aware of the risks that they were undertaking in climbing the mountain and it was irresponsible of them to believe that they knew how to take care of themselves and refuse the aide of the guides, such as Anatoli. Krakauer is one of these people. Yes, he did have previous experience, but not at that altitude nor in those conditions. Also, he assumes he knows the type of person that Anatoli is through second hand information. Even though he is correct in the assumption that Anatoli is a selfish, arrogant and antisocial bastard. I believe that this tragedy was an accident waiting to happen and that these groups gave fate the chance that it had been looking for. Everest had become a tourist attraction, and as it did, the security got lax, the groups were ill equipped, and the mountain got angry.

Sunday, October 31, 2004
09:13 AM

David Kirn ('We hate cats') -- The tragic events that were written about by both Bookreev and Krakauer were horrible. There is no doubt about this fact. What I find disheartening is the finger pointing that went on in both books. I agree with the classes assessments on a whole. Both parties had a role to play in the deaths that occurred on Mount Everest. What I disagree with is the way their books point fingers. I believe that Krakauer and Bookreev should have dug deep within themselves, and wrote about their own part in things. Both of these guys justified their behavior, blaming others for what could possibly have been their own wrong doing. Granted, to look truthfully into one's own soul is a most difficult thing. Unfortunately, to see what role one plays in a situation it is of paramount importance. Finger pointing only creates anger, resentment, and retaliation. Self assessment creates growth.

Sunday, October 31, 2004
10:48 PM

Amy Carroll, We Hate Cats - I think that when Boukreev took the guide position from Scott Fischer he was not expecting the kind of responsibility that Fischer expected from him. I think he was kind of rude by leaving the clients and running all over the mountain, this also applies to Fischer. This expedition was poorly planned and the communication equipment was terrible. If the expedition had been better planned and more logical judgment had been used maybe more people would have survived.

Monday, November 01, 2004
10:10 PM

Sean Sushi Lovers I think Boukreev is the downfall of the whole expedition. Many people relied on his expertise and he failed to help those who needed it.

Monday, November 01, 2004
10:38 PM

Michelle Cooksey- HUMANS After reading INTO THIN AIR and starting the CLIMB I feel confused about who is the "hero." I know that Scott Fischer is an idiot and caused many different problems on the mountain. As of now I don't really view anyone as a hero.

Monday, November 01, 2004
11:07 PM

Jimmy Pietrick (we hate cats) I agree with David Kirns that Boukreev and Krackauer that they shouldn't be pointing fingers at other, but should look to themselves of what more they could've really done. instead of looking for other to blame for what happened.

Tuesday, November 02, 2004
12:11 PM

Melissa Knapp - We Hate Cats It seems like Boukreev needs to be doing more considering he is getting paid to be a guide. This group is paying him to carry extra responsibilities and to be an expert for the group. He acts as if each climber is completely responsible for themselves, which if this is the case he should not be getting paid, especially at the higher price he requested.

Wednesday, November 03, 2004
09:24 AM

Amy Carroll - We Hate Cats Group. After reading everyones arguments I agree that everyone should not be pointing the finger at everyone else. These clients took on the risks and responsibility to climb this mountain. They may be able to point the finger a little bit, but not by much. People that do not have high altitude climbing experience should not be allowed to climb the mountain. This puts other people in way too much danger. I also agree that Rob's team did do a little better at keeping their team together throughout climbing the mountain, Scotts team was way too scattered.

Wednesday, November 03, 2004
10:46 AM

Travis D-Octopus- Anatoli is not to blame. He did in fact help others, tho it wasn't till people started die'n, and the only one to die in his team was scott. Some say it is everyone who is to blame. Personaly I believe it was thier human need for Victory and thier foolish pride.. Also the guides scott and rob needed to be victorius or else thier jobs may be in danger.

Wednesday, November 03, 2004
01:57 PM

Summer Barker-"We Hate Cats"- I would also have to say I agree with David Kirns standpoint on things. Both books are more or less blaming everyone else but themselves. I feel that everyone should take the blame, because it's not just Anatoli's fault. No one was prepared for what was about to take place.

Wednesday, November 03, 2004
03:36 PM

Donald Poling-We hate cats. I do believe that Boukreev was responsable for all of the climbers lives on Everest and some of the deaths. The two climbers Boukeev guided a lot of inexperienced climbers up Mt. Everest and all of which he was responsible for. The climbers knew that even though Boukeev was very sucessful on Everest there was no gaurentee that they would reach the summit or make it off the mountain alive. He was responsable for saving some lives and also loosing some.

Wednesday, November 03, 2004
05:43 PM

Russ/humans I don't know what to think. the storm is what killed people. If they all would have made it to the to when they said they were supposed to then they all would have made it home alive. It was iresponsible for the guides and team leaders to go up late even if they didn't know a storm was comming.

Wednesday, November 03, 2004
08:15 PM

Sean Sushi Lovers- I agree with Nick. Boukreev is a very selfish climber with his own well-being in mind. Rob Hall and Scott Fischer asked him along to help get people to the top but was only concerned with himself reaching the top.

Thursday, November 04, 2004
12:13 AM

Erol Atkins (Humans) I agree, at least half of the fatalities are due to entering the summit too late. If they want to pay the price then so be it....its nobodys fault for that and the guides should definitely be responsible.

Thursday, November 04, 2004
12:16 AM

Erol Atkins (Humans) Boukreev definitely has a job to do. Even if he doesnt agree or like it. Of course its his job. Leaving people behind or having his attitude should be on his own time and not the groups. He may be responsible for some deaths or maybe not. The whole thing was unprepared.

Thursday, November 04, 2004
12:16 AM

Thursday, November 04, 2004
12:27 AM

Melissa Knapp - We Hate Cats I believe Boukreev meant well, and that in his pushing each person to be responsible for themselves, he was actually strengthening them as climbers. However, I still think he should have taken on more of a leadership role.

Thursday, November 04, 2004
10:11 AM

Nick- Humans- I agree with Russ. I think that if they would have just made it to the top when planned things would have never went the way they did. If Anatoli would have done what he was hired for this could have been avoided.

Thursday, November 04, 2004
12:23 PM

Melanie Bakarian Sushi Lovers- I think that Scott's team was unprepared. I don't belive that it is to blame on Boukreev. I think that Scott is to blame because he was in charge of the expedtion and he should have ended it because of his illness.

Thursday, November 04, 2004
01:01 PM

Michelle Cooksey- Humans After viewing everyones arguements I have come to the conclusion that Boukreev took on a lot more than he was supposed to. He saw that Scott wasn't doing his job very well if doing his job at all. I still feel that there is no "hero" in the books, but the finger pointing is rediculous.

Tuesday, November 09, 2004
01:28 PM

Mike Martin-Humans-After reading everyone's arguments, I still agree with what I had orginally said. The fact that everyone is trying to point fingers I think is ridiculous, everyone should take responsibilty for their own actions, and stop blaming everyone else.